even if they are the victims of the attempt of the obama administration, correctly, to try to you know force the republicans to play ball on their terms, reality is, the collateral damage done to the poor in the meantime is so devastating, because the margin of reserve for those middle class, even compared to the poor is more significant than when you're making a dollar that you talked about and you've got go there -- i was on food stamps for three years i understand what it means to be on food stamps. most people are on welfare for two years or less, they use it as a stopgap measure. most people do not pimp the system. the perception is they pimp the system. you ain't doing much pimping on food stamps. about your a low rent pimp if you're on food stamps. >> alex? >> go ahead. >> reporter: i understand michael's point but i think he's giving obama -- underselling obama's effectiveness so far a little bit. obama doesn't talk a lot about the poor but in the negotiations, especialfully 2010, the president, his team, gene sperling and others were effective in protecting poor people's progr